Friday, February 7, 2014

Love, bombing again

So. That's that then. And how did Mr. Cameron's exhortation to hug a sweaty go down with the Great British public? They were told to make their voices heard. Did they respond?

On that metric, the speech must be judged a runaway success. The web, the news programmes, Twitter, all the instantly viewable media were awash with voices responding to the cry to smother us with love, to tell us that of course it's entirely up to us and our view will be respected whatever it is but that we'd really, really be missed. So, was that the message of the tumult: don't leave us, please, because we love you?

On that metric, the exercise must be judged as, charitably, a catastrophically disastrous failure. The rest of the UK responded just precisely as surely should have been predicted. I don't blame them. A people is told, year after year, decade after decade, that a section of them are, at best, subsidised and, at worst, spongers. Knowing and ungrateful spongers at that. That people is then told that the spongers are threatening to leave and that they should tell the spongers not to leave because they love the spongers and that they and the spongers are actually better off together. And, of course, keep subsidising the spongers so they don't leave. How do you think that people would react? How would you react? Well, that's how they reacted.

The BBC report of the speech was closed for comments after a few hours. There were 3,069 comments left. Those comments comprise raw, irrefutable data from which to assess the likely success of Mr. Cameron's initiative. I can't reproduce them all here but I claim that what follows is representative of what was overwhelmingly the mood expressed. You can check for yourself and see what you think. In fact, some comments were deleted by moderators because they did not meet the standards of decorum set by what follows. God only knows what they said. Anyway, the rest pretty much fell into the following categories:

  • we want you to go and good riddance if you do;
  • we don't want you to go but good riddance if you do;
  • we don't care if you go but if you do go it'll be a disaster for you which on balance is a shame but don't say we didn't tell you and don't think we'll let you back in;
  • we don't care if you go but if you do go it'll be a disaster for you which will serve you right and don't think we'll let you back in;
  • we shouldn't let you go whether you want to or not and if necessary should take you back by force of arms;
  • we want you to go but you won't because you know what side your bread's buttered on and will bottle it.  

I don't blame the posters for the fact that they simply are not familiar with the economic facts of the debate. Why should they be when you see the standard of news reporting on the subject? It is only recently, with GERS and the HMRC's disaggregation of accounts, that it has been relatively easy (perhaps, even, possible) comprehensibly to prove Scotland's relative wealth in relation to the rest of the UK. Even now, it takes some effort and commitment. Why should someone in England take the time and trouble to doubt what everyone has told them for decades to be true and go off on some private research exercise?

No. The real importance of all of this is not that the subsidy myth is right or wrong. It's believed to be true and that's enough. And worse, it's believed that we know it to be true and that for that reason we'll bottle it and it'll serve us right.

So, this is the point. There is an absolutely critical, fundamental question facing all of us, given all of this. But the answer to that question is informed by the answer to another one that will not even be asked of us and it is one to which, thanks to the Sun newspaper amongst others, we already know the answer:

"Is it worth continuing to give Scotland a higher share of public spending to keep it part of the UK?

No: 54%
Don't know: 22%

Excluding the don't knows, that 's just short of 70% say no, it's not worth it. And that's before the vote in September. Again, why should any of this be surprising? The rest of the UK thinks, because for decades it has constantly been told so by politicians and ill-informed commentators whose factual knowledge and grasp of the arguments rarely rises above that of Richard Madeley, that it subsidises us. And it's fed up. The fact that those who think this are demonstrably wrong doesn't matter because they don't have anyone demonstrating it to them. Worse, in fact: if they do see or read anything it is likely to be reports of Better Together up here telling us that if we vote yes all manners of disaster will befall us. No unionist politician, whether here or outwith Scotland, has any interest or anything to gain from correcting this impression and if Scots are telling themselves that they are subsidy junkies then why argue with them?

So, here's the critical, fundamental question for all of us: what do think these people will demand happens if we vote no?

Ponder that as you read the following. It's a long list but it needs to be to make the point as forcefully as it merits. You can always scroll back and forwards amongst the messages. They're pretty much uniform. (The number order reflects the fact that they were copied from a list ordered by approval, not time of posting):

   " Comment number 53.
    9 Hours ago

    Another reason for me not to vote for Cameron. As an English woman, I think England should also get the vote about this, we appear to fund the Scots all the time. Why do they not pay for prescriptions, their universities are free., etc., etc. So Scotland, go please.

    Comment number 93.
    9 Hours ago

    So long Scotland. You won't be missed.

    Comment number 34.
    Major Dennis Bloodnok
    9 Hours ago

    Just GO Scotland, but when you do don't forget to take back the 5 million or so who live south of the border.

    Comment number 403.
    9 Hours ago

    LEAVE! GO! I want independence for England, but I don't get a vote. So if you go, then we only have the Welsh and N Irish to deal with

    Comment number 804.
    8 Hours ago

    Scots, please vote for independence. We don't want you to carry on leeching on us. Thanks.

    Comment number 5.
    10 Hours ago

    If Scotland vote to stay in then the rest of us should have a reforendum to decide if we want to keep them. If they decide to go then they go alone, no currency, no NHS, no benefits, no roads, no schools - its all down to them - good luck with that.

    Comment number 2512.
    4 Hours ago

    If they vote no, strip them of all the benefits the English don't get. No more free prescriptions, free higher education etc. England has to stop subsiding them & treat everyone equally.

    Comment number 2922.
    Spencer Egham
    3 Hours ago

    Looks like the moderators are either Scottish or Northern or just in denial, must be based at the new Media City, as they don't like the fact that the woes of Scotland and the North are of their own local making and its time they stopped blaming London and SE for their local woes and take responsibility to improve their own areas instead of begging money of London & SE as its simply not deserved!

    Comment number 2513.
    4 Hours ago

    How come the English don't get to vote on this? I'd vote for a separate Scotland, Wales too. I'm fed up of subsidising countries who constantly whine about "the English" You want to pay for another few hundred politicians in it for themselves? Go for it, vote YES!!

    Did you not learn anything from the cost of your parliament building? Vote Yes!!! And give us the £billions we poured into RBS!

    Comment number 1946.
    5 Hours ago

    A parcel of gold is all it takes. Bribe them off and they'll be compliant for a few more decades.

    Comment number 1517.
    6 Hours ago

    This man; David Cameron; does not speak for the people of the UK. He was not elected by the people. He is the head of a puppet coalition government that couldn't govern their way out of a wet paper bag.

    I invite the populous of Scotland to vote 'Yes' in the upcoming referendum. I for one, will be glad to be rid of the Scots; they sully the good name of Britain.

    Comment number 1331.
    6 Hours ago

    Like Alaska is to the US, Scotland is to the UK.A pain in the backside.
    Sooner the better.

    Comment number 2750.
    3 Hours ago

    The Scots would not be even considering going it alone if there was no oil in the North Sea, nothing else any good comes out of their and we have subsidized them for the last few hundred years ,so good riddance I say.

    Comment number 2752.
    Big Cat
    3 Hours ago

    No Sterling, No Euro, No Lender of Last Resort. At least you may have Russia wishing to buy you in times of trouble. We've bailed you out twice and it gets boring! Good luck!

    Comment number 2934.
    Big Cat
    3 Hours ago

    I wouldn't fancy being 'Alex the Salmon' in 2020 if he did manage to get a 'Yes' vote. The Scottish people would be asking questions as to why they weren't getting more benefits and lower taxes by that point. Still he'll probably start bleeding the system on day one, that seems to be the way of the majority of nations with no ties to other nations.

    Comment number 2991.
    2 Hours ago

    I hope they break away and wouldn't give a penny in loans - call all loans back immediately. No military defence unless they pay through the nose, and repatriation of all Scots (this generation) living here (mixed couples to have the choice). Border controls to be introduced with a permanent boycott of all Scottish imports. Disbandment of sports bodies such as Team GB, etc.

    Comment number 3057.
    2 Hours ago

    Great Britain is far better off staying together, NI, Wales and Scotland all have an important part to play. England is obviously the main partner but it has the greater population and wealth. I fear for an independent Scotland, what are the benefits? I mean the ones that are affordable and realistic not this pie in the sky claptrap spouted by SNP.

    Comment number 3005.
    2 Hours ago

    Truth be told oil revenue will get Scotland nowhere, as the big companies based in the UK (England) won't want to see the profits drop from buying Scottish oil. To recoup costs Scotland will pay more for petrol and the cost of living will go up.
    Add to that having to set up your own currency and take your share of nation debt Scottish independence would be doing doing England an economic favour

    Comment number 3032.
    2 Hours ago

    As one man said many years ago “ let my people go ” Scotland will do the right thing, hopefully Northern Ireland next to go.

    Comment number 2949.
    2 Hours ago

    2918. Northern1

    Absolutely correct! Alex Salmond and crew are blinded by ideology and are therefore unfit to run a country without prejudice.

    There'll be bickering for years and years about who has to do what and why. The only thing this will do is damage confidence in both the English and Scottish economies which means EVERYONE will suffer.

    Comment number 2674.
    3 Hours ago

    I don't believe that the Scots will be taken in by Salmond's self interest and mammoth deception as to what will happen to the Scottish people. The economy will cough and splutter with the eventual abandonment of the pound and then they will slide into a status of a non-European country directionless and broke. ALL my Scots friends are voting NO and terrified for their jobs etc,

    Comment number 2569.
    4 Hours ago

    I'm English and i love Scotland but most of the people in Scotland have this strange hatred for English people. Not all, but most. I'm tired of all this animosity from a country that is heavily subsidised by England. What is the saying? Don't bite the hand that feeds you? I hope the yes voters come out in force and Scotland goes it's own way. Good luck to them

    Comment number 1847.
    5 Hours ago

    Let Scotland have its independence , we in England can then stop subsidising them and we can then pay less tax.

    Comment number 2167.
    Spencer Egham
    5 Hours ago

    Fed up with the "Racist" comments towards England from Scots they're fast to bleat with Self Pity "Racism" the moment anything's said about Scotland no matter how trivial or correct. Lets see the back of them and any future Labour government in England. If the self pity & small minded Northerners want to go let them too. You are happy sponging of London & SE, stop biting the hand that feeds you

    Comment number 2188.
    The original Pete
    5 Hours ago

    I wish Scotland would get on with it and clear off.

    Comment number 8.
    10 Hours ago

    Go for it Scotland don't worry about the nukes we will let em off as we leave

    Comment number 1115.
    7 Hours ago

    Aren't the Scottish lucky that they are even allowed a referendum and choose what THEY want to do! A vast majority of the UK population would like a referendum on pulling out the EU and we don't get it! One rule for them. Another for us!

    Comment number 1119.
    Christal Palace
    7 Hours ago

    Aww screw it... lets just let them leave then wipe them off the face of the planet with OUR Trident nukes :)

    Comment number 2152.
    5 Hours ago

    All these people on here commenting about how hard up they are and how lucky they are in the South - yawn, you try pay £300,000.00 then for a shed in London.

    When Scotland gain independence they will be crying about Glasgow being favoured? All country's have their major city's its a fact of life get over it

    Comment number 1907.
    5 Hours ago

    You cannot have independence without equality, the scots need to remember it was British Pounds that have invested in Oil not just scottish ones therefore you do not get to keep the oil because it happens to be in Scotland which was part of the union when explration commenced back in the 60's
    I'd be glad just to see the end of it either way, from an independence perspective my ears are bleeding.

    Comment number 2012.
    5 Hours ago

    If I had a vote (I don't) it would probably be YES. I've had a lifetime of listening to whinging Scots blaming all their woes on England while taking handouts from south of the border. I don't want us paying more bribes to maintain the union. I feel sorry for the many decent, thinking Scots but I'm not sure that you're in a majority. No fudges (currency, banks, etc.), just go. Clean break!

    Comment number 1279.
    Peter Birch
    6 Hours ago

    NEWS FLASH! - Scottish no longer to work at the BBC and Scottish residents in England to be charged at the top level of tax - all Government departments to leave Scotland, Nuclear Fleet to be based in England - Well done great news for Alex Salmond and his band of bigots!

    Comment number 2475.
    4 Hours ago

    Interesting how he challenges Cameron to a debate and not any other Englishman, Northern Irishman or Welshman. More importantly, no non-politicians. In truth the yes/no is irrelevant. A vote for indepedence is a vote for Salmond to become Scottish prime minister which is even more damning for Scotland than Cameron... and thats really saying something

    Comment number 2681.
    3 Hours ago

    The fact that so much seems to revolve around trifling and unpredictable economic outcomes speaks volumes about this debate.

    If the Union is so bad and so oppressive then surely any price is worth paying for "freedom"? Or is it just a vague antipathy towards England that, under any other circumstances would be classed as bigotry?

    Scotland the Brave??? More like "Och what aboot ma ISA?"

    Comment number 2666.
    3 Hours ago

    I don't mind if Scotland goes or stays. If they go I'd like it made clear to them that they can't come back in; ever.

    Oh, and if they do go I'd rather they weren't allowed to keep the pound (£).

    Comment number 2932.
    3 Hours ago

    Put up or shut up for the Scottish people. They have spent whole lives (and their parents and grand parents) whinging about being part of UK. The rest of UK don't mind what decision is as long as they don't continue whining if it a NO vote

    Comment number 2988.
    Peter C
    2 Hours ago

    Goodbye to the Scotch National Socialists, shut the door behind you.

    Comment number 3052.
    2 Hours ago

    Lets face the facts though, Salmond will make sure Braveheart is on TV the night prior to the vote. So it's a yes!!!

    Comment number 2902.
    3 Hours ago

    The scots don't want nuclear weapons yet they are going on strike at faslane for more pay. make your minds up.

    If the scots go independent all those defense jobs and ship yards move to england and the english and welsh get a jobs bonanza. Not to mention all those public sector jobs.

    Keep your oil and we'll take the hi tech jobs. And you don't get free tuition fees, you pay for it through tax.

    Comment number 2929.
    3 Hours ago

    This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

    Comment number 2840.
    3 Hours ago

    Interesting to see Scotland paying for their own tuition fees and prescriptions like the rest of us in England!!

    Comment number 2552.
    4 Hours ago

    The Scot Nats are so desperate to run Scotland they are giving immature children of 16 the right to vote. It is deplorable that the fate of the UK, never mind Scotland, is going to be put in the hands of children. It is a medical fact that the brains of children this age are not fully developed and here are 'responsible' politicians so fixated on power that they will do this. Utterly disgraceful.

    Comment number 1311.
    6 Hours ago

    I would deal with this like you should deal with a teenage runaway; if they want to go, then let them go. They will come home when they get hungry and we will welcome them back. Salmond won't be welcome back though because he is a trouble maker. He should be put in irons in Edinburgh Castle as a tourist attraction.

    Comment number 16.
    10 Hours ago

    Why is it only the scots can vote ?
    They must now realise that the rest of the UK want them gone and without the Pound, NHS or any aid.
    Its time to rid the rest of the UK of these parasites

    Comment number 104.
    Darren Jacques
    9 Hours ago

    why do the scots get a vote to say they if they want to stay. Why cant we vote to get rid of them?

    Comment number 129.
    9 Hours ago

    I think David Cameron has misjudged how the English think about Scottish independence
    The majority don't care or actually want them to become independent
    Subsidised nation on wealth CREATED in England and then moan and complain.
    La la land
    The major positive if independent is that Labour would never get into Westminster again
    Imagine that, no more Gordon a Brown types !

    Comment number 1054.
    7 Hours ago

    This debate affects all UK residents and as such everyone should have a vote. I would like Sturgeon and Salmon to come down to the rest of the UK and give their usual spiel or are they cowards hiding behind Hadrian's Wall?.
    For me, let them have independence but it must be total. RBS debts and all. All Scots in rest of UK to have ID cards.

    Comment number 970.
    Wet Wheels
    7 Hours ago

    Instead of whinging, can you all please hurry up and go.

    The South

    Comment number 852.
    Jo Anton
    8 Hours ago

    The people of Scotland have to take a long view when they vote. This decision is final.
    They should ignore the short-term difficulties as Scotland leaves the EU and resolves currency issues.
    In the long term they will probably be able to become EU members and join the Euro if they wish. As a small nation this is their best option, to operate under the supporting umbrella of a benevolent democracy.

    Comment number 810.
    8 Hours ago

    This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

    Comment number 462.
    8 Hours ago

    Let Scotland go to Salmon and the Scots. We would will not have to pay them any longer.

    Comment number 2317.
    4 Hours ago

    Let them have their independance.......if we have ever any use for Scotland we can do what we have traditionally done and take it back by force

    Comment number 2280.
    4 Hours ago

    Bye Bye Scotland, enjoy your euros and socialism. Once you have gone please do not embrace yourselves by asking to join back up again.

    Comment number 2291.
    4 Hours ago

    I love Scotland but if they leave the UK I will not go there on holiday, drink the whisky and will cancel all policies with Scottish insurance companies.

    Comment number 2278.
    Paul Bohane
    4 Hours ago

    Why do we want to keep Scotland? Let it float away and then we can stop transferring the ludicrously large amounts of money over the border from England to subsidise their education, health and general social security practices which they get SO MUCH MORE per head for than England does
   Comment number 1810.
    5 Hours ago

    Can you please change the headline to -

    Scottish independence: Seven months left of the Scots, no more Barnett Formula, HOORAY, the English say.......

    Comment number 1906.
    5 Hours ago

    Sooner Scotland leaves the better ,

    Unless England has the same rights as the other 3 countries ie Devolution for England and the othe countries mps not voting on english issues

    If this is not going to happen - THEN SCOTLAND get lost !

    Comment number 1900.
    5 Hours ago

    The ridiculous SNP's premise is based upon rUK preventing plucky Scotland from achieving its godgiven place as a Norway/Switzerland. They won't mention the huge financial, technical and military support from more prosperous parts of the UK, e.g. RBS/HBOS bailout £30-40 billion, military bases, BAe shipbuilding, the Barnett formula etc and wont canvas the views of c1million Scots in E&W, cowards!

    Comment number 1918.
    5 Hours ago

    I simply wish Alex Salmond and his party of racist whiners would stuff off. If independence means I get a life free from ever having to listen to some whinging Scot again then I'm all for it.

    Comment number 1472.
    6 Hours ago

    Scotland should stay with UK, but if they choose not to then we should ensure they get the full deal without compromise:

    Exclude all the benefits they take for granted - e.g. full weather forecasts, English TV, English football broadcasts - the lot. - do not compromise - let them cater for themselves and see what it brings them.

    Comment number 1717.
    British Patriot
    6 Hours ago

    Scotland is a socialist loser nation, let them be independent. Hopefully the welfare state infested north of England can go too. Let's see how they like it when Russia bullies them when we take our nukes back haha!


    Comment number 1699.
    Collin A
    6 Hours ago

    Scotland has always been a drain on English resources

    Comment number 1644.
    ukip all the way
    6 Hours ago

    So if they leave , then I take it they will have the euro for their money ?
    Give it 6 months and Scotland will be cap in hand asking for a bail our from the bank.
    I want the UK to remain , however if they want to leave , let them . Then when they are on their knees they might understand how important England and their hand outs have been to them .

    Comment number 1594.
    6 Hours ago

    A polite from the Prime Minister met with rudeness and insults from Scottish ministers. They really are showing themselves to be nasty and bitter people.


    Comment number 1321.
    6 Hours ago

    You do understand that the Scottish Parliament doesn't pay for everything? Huge chunks are paid out by the central government such as debt servicing, defence and the entire welfare state.

    Comment number 1335.
    6 Hours ago

    Hey Scotland, you can have your independance but this time don't waste all your money then come crying to England about it like last time.

    Comment number 1346.
    6 Hours ago

    So farewell then all you Bravehearts!! And don't forget to take your own currency, civil service, health service and education system with you. Oh yes, and don't forget to pay for it yourselves. Quite frankly it will be fun to see all those Scots down here become immediate foreigners. Such fun.

    Comment number 1425.
    6 Hours ago

    I like most English people hope they vote for independence

    Firstly it would mean we wouldnt have to listen to their constant moaning, second it makes it far less likely those idiots in the labour party would ever get elected again

    Comment number 1283.
    Swing Lowe
    6 Hours ago

    Salmond seems to be using Brave Heart as his inspiration to form an independent state, what he needs to realize he is no William Wallace, The monarchy of Scotland & England united under James I (who was Scottish) and the people of Scotland are more educated than in the days of long bows & war horses.
    These are same tactics Hitler employed to mobilize German youth and those easily influenced

    Comment number 1169.
    7 Hours ago

    As an Englishman I would like a vote. My vote would be to set Scotland free and make sure they take their Banks wqith them.

    Comment number 1212.
    7 Hours ago

    I am so pleased Scotland is having a vote, maybe it will stop them from trying to blackmail the rest of us for more money, more power, more more, more.
    What ever they decide, I wish them well, but they should not get more money per capita than the rest of us for education or health and other amenities, but please stop complaining.

    Comment number 2361.
    4 Hours ago

    The English have subsidised Scotland for years, a deliberate transfer of about 4p/£1 income tax. That would have to be replaced or spending severely restricted.

    The English have bailed out Scotland in 1707 and 2008, we would not do that again, now would we.

    But as we all know, the mix of our cultures has made us the envy of the world: creative and great financiers, let us preserve that.

    Comment number 2874.
    3 Hours ago

    this is not about independence this is about politics and power from a very smug ego hunting alex salmon trying to get in history books of scotland with his pied piper approach , Scotland could end up being an Independent one party state remember what happens to lemmings no going back so good luck

    Comment number 2809.
    3 Hours ago

    We should give Scotland independence. Wait till the Scottish economy and society collapses, then invade the country and completely destroy its infrastructure. As Dave says, its hundreds of years of History hanging, and since he wants to take us back to the middle ages, we might as well do it as the middle ages did, or even Game Of Thrones. Either, it'll make a good series for TV.

    Comment number 2690.
    3 Hours ago

    Lots of use of the word 'Nationalist'.
    Lot's of talk of an egalitarian 'socialist' independent Scotland.
    Hang on!
    National? Socialist?
    Where and when have I hear that before...Munich....1933? :o)

    Comment number 2939.
    3 Hours ago

    Just some food for thought, the Scottish NHS takes about 1/3rd of the total budget of what Scotland spends. But where does most of that money come from?

    Also who will fund air/sea rescue when they go back to the rest of the UK? Scotland would have to fund those emergency services themselves.

    Same with university fees. Where do those subsidies come from?

    Comment number 2626.
    3 Hours ago

    Oh please God let's be rid of the whinging Scots. There will be no going back and only after they vote YES will they realise what a load of rubbish Salmond has been spouting. Big business and UK defence will run away south of the boarder and Scotland will be an insignificant country in the EU on the bottom rung of the power and influence ladder. Good riddance.

    Comment number 2740.
    3 Hours ago

    Please please Scots vote yes, as an Englishman I would welcome the reduction in labour politicians, the resolution of the Midlothian problem (Scots over representation in the UK Parliament) and the continuous moaning from the Scots Govt that everything is Englands fault

    Comment number 2369.
    4 Hours ago

    Fully agree with all those saying we in England should get a vote.

    I for one would vote to get rid of Scotland. I am fed up with seeing that grinning Salmond on my TV screen.

    Comment number 2387.
    catherine beak
    4 Hours ago

    I think it would be interesting to see how the remainder of the UK would vote, if we were allowed to!
    If I had a vote, it would be for Scotland to be independent and for England to have our own parliament with purey English MPs in it.
    let's here it for ENGLAND!

    Comment number 1015.
    7 Hours ago

    He is such a liar, We want Scotland to stay as far away as possible, I have tugs ready to tow it away.

    Comment number 814.
    8 Hours ago

    I'm tired of the prime minister telling the scots'..we want you to stay' . no-one's bothered to ask i want scotland to stay!.
    Let them go,who needs them, and we won't have to listen anymore to their whining. just don't let the door hit you on the backside when you leave. "


  1. Oh my God.
    What a catalog of misery, ignorance, bigotry, racism and pure, sheer stupidity.
    But it's not their fault: these people are the poisoned fruits of the seeds planted and watered for decades with lies and deceit by TV, radio and - especially - newspapers on the payroll of Westminster's puppeteers.
    Good luck to whoever will be governing rUK and will have to deal with the backlash of sheer hate and revolt, when these ignorant masses will smash their faces against reality, not to mention the massive economic downturn that will hit them when Osborne's cuts come into play.
    The OECD predicts an independent Scotland to rank at #5 in the chart of wealthy countries, while rUK falls from 11 to 14.
    Guess who will be worse off on the international financial markets and in trouble to service their public debt.
    Guess who will have problems sharing the same currency with a country with a stronger, richer, more balanced economy based on oil, science, technology, manufacturing, and a number of other industries, rather than just on the extremely volatile and insecure financial services sector.
    So sorry, but these people have been living in koo-koo land so far.
    Ignorance is no excuse.

  2. I'm waiting for the reports on Distorting Scotland. Mind you, it'll be a cold day in hell before they do,